It is no doubt Grayscale’s booming popularity as a mainstream investment has caused a lot of community hullabaloo lately. As such, I felt it was worth making a FAQ regarding the topic. I’m looking to update this as needed and of course am open to suggestions / adding any questions. The goal is simply to have a thread we can link to anyone with questions on Grayscaleand its products. Instead of explaining the same thing 3 times a day, shoot those posters over to this thread.My hope is that these questions are answered in a fairly simple and easy to understand manner. I think as the sub grows it will be a nice reference point for newcomers. Disclaimer: I do NOT work for Grayscale and as such am basing all these answers on information that can be found on their website / reports. (Grayscale’s official FAQ can be found here). I also do NOT have a finance degree, I do NOT have a Series 6 / 7 / 140-whatever, and I do NOT work with investment products for my day job. I have an accounting background and work within the finance world so I have the general ‘business’ knowledge to put it all together, but this is all info determined in my best faith effort as a layman. The point being is this --- it is possible I may explain something wrong or missed the technical terms, and if that occurs I am more than happy to update anything that can be proven incorrect Everything below will be in reference to ETHE but will apply to GBTC as well.If those two segregate in any way, I will note that accordingly.
ETHE is essentially a stock that intends to loosely track the price of ETH. It does so by having each ETHE be backed by a specific amount of ETH that is held on chain. Initially, the newly minted ETHE can only be purchased by institutions and accredited investors directly from Grayscale. Once a year has passed (6 months for GBTC) it can then be listed on the OTCQX Best Market exchange for secondary trading. Once listed on OTCQX, anyone investor can purchase at this point. Additional information on ETHE can be found here.
So ETHE is an ETF?
No. For technical reasons beyond my personal understandings it is not labeled an ETF. I know it all flows back to the “Securities Act Rule 144”, but due to my limited knowledge on SEC regulations I don’t want to misspeak past that. If anyone is more knowledgeable on the subject I am happy to input their answer here.
How long has ETHE existed?
ETHE was formed 12/14/2017. GBTC was formed 9/25/2013.
How is ETHE created?
The trust will issue shares to “Authorized Participants” in groups of 100 shares (called baskets). Authorized Participants are the only persons that may place orders to create these baskets and they do it on behalf of the investor. Source: Creation and Redemption of Shares section on page 39 of the “Grayscale Ethereum Trust Annual Report (2019)” – Located Here Note – The way their reports word this makes it sound like there is an army of authorizers doing the dirty work, but in reality there is only one Authorized Participant. At this moment the “Genesis” company is the sole Authorized Participant. Genesis is owned by the “Digital Currency Group, Inc.” which is the parent company of Grayscale as well. (And to really go down the rabbit hole it looks like DCG is the parent company of CoinDesk and is “backing 150+ companies across 30 countries, including Coinbase, Ripple, and Chainalysis.”) Source: Digital Currency Group, Inc. informational section on page 77 of the “Grayscale Bitcoin Trust (BTC) Form 10-K (2019)” – Located Here Source: Barry E. Silbert informational section on page 75 of the “Grayscale Bitcoin Trust (BTC) Form 10-K (2019)” – Located Here
How does Grayscale acquire the ETH to collateralize the ETHE product?
An Investor may acquire ETHE by paying in cash or exchanging ETH already owned.
Cash: The investor pays the subscription amount in cash and the Authorized Participant will use that cash to purchase ETH.
ETH: The investor transfers the ETH to the Authorized Participant, which will contribute the ETH in-kind to the Trust.
Source: Creation and Redemption of Shares section on page 40 of the “Grayscale Ethereum Trust Annual Report (2019)” – Located Here
Where does Grayscale store their ETH? Does it have a specific wallet address we can follow?
ETH is stored with Coinbase Custody Trust Company, LLC. I am unaware of any specific address or set of addresses that can be used to verify the ETH is actually there. As an aside - I would actually love to see if anyone knows more about this as it’s something that’s sort of peaked my interest after being asked about it… I find it doubtful we can find that however. Source: Part C. Business Information, Item 8, subsection A. on page 16 of the “Grayscale Ethereum Trust Annual Report (2019)” – Located Here
Can ETHE be redeemed for ETH?
No, currently there is no way to give your shares of ETHE back to Grayscale to receive ETH back. The only method of getting back into ETH would be to sell your ETHE to someone else and then use those proceeds to buy ETH yourself. Source: Redemption Procedures on page 41 of the “Grayscale Ethereum Trust Annual Report (2019)” – Located Here
Why are they not redeeming shares?
I think the report summarizes it best:
Redemptions of Shares are currently not permitted and the Trust is unable to redeem Shares. Subject to receipt of regulatory approval from the SEC and approval by the Sponsor in its sole discretion, the Trust may in the future operate a redemption program. Because the Trust does not believe that the SEC would, at this time, entertain an application for the waiver of rules needed in order to operate an ongoing redemption program, the Trust currently has no intention of seeking regulatory approval from the SEC to operate an ongoing redemption program.
Source: Redemption Procedures on page 41 of the “Grayscale Ethereum Trust Annual Report (2019)” – Located Here
What is the fee structure?
ETHE has an annual fee of 2.5%. GBTC has an annual fee of 2.0%. Fees are paid by selling the underlying ETH / BTC collateralizing the asset. Source: ETHE’s informational page on Grayscale’s website - Located Here Source: Description of Trust on page 31 & 32 of the “Grayscale Ethereum Trust Annual Report (2019)” – Located Here
What is the ratio of ETH to ETHE?
At the time of posting (6/19/2020) each ETHE share is backed by .09391605 ETH. Each share of GBTC is backed by .00096038 BTC. ETHE & GBTC’s specific information page on Grayscale’s website updates the ratio daily – Located Here For a full historical look at this ratio, it can be found on the Grayscale home page on the upper right side if you go to Tax Documents > 2019 Tax Documents > Grayscale Ethereum Trust 2019 Tax Letter.
Why is the ratio not 1:1? Why is it always decreasing?
While I cannot say for certain why the initial distribution was not a 1:1 backing, it is more than likely to keep the price down and allow more investors a chance to purchase ETHE / GBTC. As noted above, fees are paid by selling off the ETH collateralizing ETHE. So this number will always be trending downward as time goes on. Source: Description of Trust on page 32 of the “Grayscale Ethereum Trust Annual Report (2019)” – Located Here
I keep hearing about how this is locked supply… explain?
As noted above, there is currently no redemption program for converting your ETHE back into ETH. This means that once an ETHE is issued, it will remain in circulation until a redemption program is formed --- something that doesn’t seem to be too urgent for the SEC or Grayscale at the moment. Tiny amounts will naturally be removed due to fees, but the bulk of the asset is in there for good. Knowing that ETHE cannot be taken back and destroyed at this time, the ETH collateralizing it will not be removed from the wallet for the foreseeable future. While it is not fully locked in the sense of say a totally lost key, it is not coming out any time soon. Per their annual statement:
The Trust’s ETH will be transferred out of the ETH Account only in the following circumstances: (i) transferred to pay the Sponsor’s Fee or any Additional Trust Expenses, (ii) distributed in connection with the redemption of Baskets (subject to the Trust’s obtaining regulatory approval from the SEC to operate an ongoing redemption program and the consent of the Sponsor), (iii) sold on an as-needed basis to pay Additional Trust Expenses or (iv) sold on behalf of the Trust in the event the Trust terminates and liquidates its assets or as otherwise required by law or regulation.
Source: Description of Trust on page 31 of the “Grayscale Ethereum Trust Annual Report (2019)” – Located Here
Grayscale now owns a huge chunk of both ETH and BTC’s supply… should we be worried about manipulation, a sell off to crash the market crash, a staking cartel?
First, it’s important to remember Grayscale is a lot more akin to an exchange then say an investment firm. Grayscale is working on behalf of its investors to create this product for investor control. Grayscale doesn’t ‘control’ the ETH it holds any more then Coinbase ‘controls’ the ETH in its hot wallet. (Note: There are likely some varying levels of control, but specific to this topic Grayscale cannot simply sell [legally, at least] the ETH by their own decision in the same manner Coinbase wouldn't be able to either.) That said, there shouldn’t be any worry in the short to medium time-frame. As noted above, Grayscale can’t really remove ETH other than for fees or termination of the product. At 2.5% a year, fees are noise in terms of volume. Grayscale seems to be the fastest growing product in the crypto space at the moment and termination of the product seems unlikely. IF redemptions were to happen tomorrow, it’s extremely unlikely we would see a mass exodus out of the product to redeem for ETH. And even if there was incentive to get back to ETH, the premium makes it so that it would be much more cost effective to just sell your ETHE on the secondary market and buy ETH yourself. Remember, any redemption is up to the investors and NOT something Grayscale has direct control over.
Yes, but what about [insert criminal act here]…
Alright, yes. Technically nothing is stopping Grayscale from selling all the ETH / BTC and running off to the Bahamas (Hawaii?). BUT there is no real reason for them to do so. Barry is an extremely public figure and it won’t be easy for him to get away with that. Grayscale’s Bitcoin Trust creates SEC reports weekly / bi-weekly and I’m sure given the sentiment towards crypto is being watched carefully. Plus, Grayscale is making tons of consistent revenue and thus has little to no incentive to give that up for a quick buck.
That’s a lot of ‘happy little feels’ Bob, is there even an independent audit or is this Tether 2.0?
Actually yes, an independent auditor report can be found in their annual reports. It is clearly aimed more towards the financial side and I doubt the auditors are crypto savants, but it is at least one extra set of eyes. Auditors are Friedman LLP – Auditor since 2015. Source: Independent Auditor Report starting on page 116 (of the PDF itself) of the “Grayscale Ethereum Trust Annual Report (2019)” – Located Here As mentioned by user TheCrpytosAndBloods (In Comments Below), a fun fact:
The company’s auditors Friedman LLP were also coincidentally TetheBitfinex’s auditors until They controversially parted ways in 2018 when the Tether controversy was at its height. I am not suggesting for one moment that there is anything shady about DCG - I just find it interesting it’s the same auditor.
“Grayscale sounds kind of lame” / “Not your keys not your crypto!” / “Why is anyone buying this, it sounds like a scam?”
Welp, for starters this honestly is not really a product aimed at the people likely to be reading this post. To each their own, but do remember just because something provides no value to you doesn’t mean it can’t provide value to someone else. That said some of the advertised benefits are as follows:
Access to trading within a tax advantaged retirement account
Institutions can easily and safely get exposure to crypto in a more legal-friendly manner
Ease of use for those who are not very technologically savvy
Ease of access for someone who doesn’t want to set up a Coinbase account
Perceived trust in institutional platforms over something like Coinbase or Kraken
Degen traders who just want access to the volatility ETHE provides that have no interest in crypto beyond that
So for example, I can set up an IRA at a brokerage account that has $0 trading fees. Then I can trade GBTC and ETHE all day without having to worry about tracking my taxes. All with the relative safety something like E-Trade provides over Binance. As for how it benefits the everyday ETH holder? I think the supply lock is a positive. I also think this product exposes the Ethereum ecosystem to people who otherwise wouldn’t know about it.
Why is there a premium? Why is ETHE’s premium so insanely high compared to GBTC’s premium?
There are a handful of theories of why a premium exists at all, some even mentioned in the annual report. The short list is as follows:
ETHE is NOT redeeming shares and as such doesn’t have an effective arbitrage mechanism
ETHE has a 1 year wait to be sold on the secondary market, again negating the ability to effectively arbitrage the premium
People may simply be willing to pay a premium for the benefits stated above.
Why is ETHE’s so much higher the GBTC’s? Again, a few thoughts:
ETHE hasn’t been around as long, so there is less secondary market supply to go around
ETHE was listed at an insanely high premium to begin with
ETHE might simply be more popular at the moment
Could just be sheer stupidity (investors think ETHE is a 1:1 ratio not 1:11)
Are there any other differences between ETHE and GBTC?
I touched on a few of the smaller differences, but one of the more interesting changes is GBTC is now a “SEC reporting company” as of January 2020. Which again goes beyond my scope of knowledge so I won’t comment on it too much… but the net result is GBTC is now putting out weekly / bi-weekly 8-K’s and annual 10-K’s. This means you can track GBTC that much easier at the moment as well as there is an extra layer of validity to the product IMO.
I’m looking for some statistics on ETHE… such as who is buying, how much is bought, etc?
There is a great Q1 2020 report I recommend you give a read that has a lot of cool graphs and data on the product. It’s a little GBTC centric, but there is some ETHE data as well. It can be found here hidden within the 8-K filings.Q1 2020 is the 4/16/2020 8-K filing. For those more into a GAAP style report see the 2019 annual 10-K of the same location.
Is Grayscale only just for BTC and ETH?
No, there are other products as well. In terms of a secondary market product, ETCG is the Ethereum Classic version of ETHE. Fun Fact – ETCG was actually put out to the secondary market first. It also has a 3% fee tied to it where 1% of it goes to some type of ETC development fund. In terms of institutional and accredited investors, there are a few ‘fan favorites’ such as Bitcoin Cash, Litcoin, Stellar, XRP, and Zcash. Something called Horizion (Backed by ZEN I guess? Idk to be honest what that is…). And a diversified Mutual Fund type fund that has a little bit of all of those. None of these products are available on the secondary market.
Are there alternatives to Grayscale?
I know they exist, but I don’t follow them. I’ll leave this as a “to be edited” section and will add as others comment on what they know. Per user Over-analyser (in comments below):
As asked by pegcity - Okay so I was under the impression you can just give them your own ETH and get ETHE, but do you get 11 ETHE per ETH or do you get the market value of ETH in USD worth of ETHE?
I have always understood that the ETHE issued directly through Grayscale is issued without the premium. As in, if I were to trade 1 ETH for ETHE I would get 11, not say only 2 or 3 because the secondary market premium is so high. And if I were paying cash only I would be paying the price to buy 1 ETH to get my 11 ETHE. Per page 39 of their annual statement, it reads as follows:
The Trust will issue Shares to Authorized Participants from time to time, but only in one or more Baskets (with a Basket being a block of 100 Shares). The Trust will not issue fractions of a Basket. The creation (and, should the Trust commence a redemption program, redemption) of Baskets will be made only in exchange for the delivery to the Trust, or the distribution by the Trust, of the number of whole and fractional ETH represented by each Basket being created (or, should the Trust commence a redemption program, redeemed), which is determined by dividing (x) the number of ETH owned by the Trust at 4:00 p.m., New York time, on the trade date of a creation or redemption order, after deducting the number of ETH representing the U.S. dollar value of accrued but unpaid fees and expenses of the Trust (converted using the ETH Index Price at such time, and carried to the eighth decimal place), by (y) the number of Shares outstanding at such time (with the quotient so obtained calculated to one one-hundred-millionth of one ETH (i.e., carried to the eighth decimal place)), and multiplying such quotient by 100 (the “Basket ETH Amount”). All questions as to the calculation of the Basket ETH Amount will be conclusively determined by the Sponsor and will be final and binding on all persons interested in the Trust. The Basket ETH Amount multiplied by the number of Baskets being created or redeemed is the “Total Basket ETH Amount.” The number of ETH represented by a Share will gradually decrease over time as the Trust’s ETH are used to pay the Trust’s expenses. Each Share represented approximately 0.0950 ETH and 0.0974 ETH as of December 31, 2019 and 2018, respectively.
AMA Recap of CEO and Co-founder of Chromia, Henrik Hjelte in the @binancenigeria Telegram group on 03/05/2020.
Best General RenVM Questions of April 2020 \These questions are sourced directly from Telegram* Q: Quick question here, but any plan to bridge as well with the Tezos protocol? Using soon to be released Ren network could be a key advantage to be the first with a viable solution on their protocol. Plus Ren is indépendant of ETH (collateral speaking) making it interesting for other protocols. A: Yes, this is very much possible. RenVM can work with any ‘destination chain’ that has smart contract functionality. We’ll be exploring others like Polkadot, Tezos, etc.. once it makes sense and we are happy with the Ethereum side of things. Q: How many physical Darknodes will be in Greycore? A: It depends on the final cohort, but it’ll be 15+ as each team will run a few Darknodes. Even the Greycore, our most “centralized” part of RenVM (at first) will be more decentralized than all competitors. Also, it is not so important the number of nodes as it is the number of members. More nodes = more architectural decentralization, but not more political decentralization. That is, more fault tolerance, but not more Byzantine fault tolerance. Q: Once RenVM gets going, is there a way to measure cross-(on)chain volume? A: We’ll be measuring any/all volume that flows through RenVM. This info will be available in the new Command Center (CC), GraphProtocol, etc. Q: What is the reasoning for disabling auto-updates for Darknodes? Will operators get to choose if auto updates are allowed or not? A: Auto updates of things that control funds is generally a bad idea. Someone could poison the repo you’re using for updates and you’d have no control. Further, disabling auto-updating means that governance is in the hands of the Darknodes, albeit in a very ad hoc way (excluding the smart contracts on Ethereum). Q: I know you have addressed this before, but here’s a discussion about ren’s ability to mint renBTC being limited by its public market cap. I think the team is coming up with a way to have the Darknode capacity determined by Darknodes based on revenue rather than the price of ren right? A: This design is one of RenVM's biggest comparative advantages over other designs. The value of REN (as calculated by Darknodes) and thus RenVM's capacity are directly tied to usage of RenVM. The more renBTC minted/burned, the greater Darknodes' revenues, the higher value of REN, the greater capacity to mint more. It's a positive feedback loop where increased usage increases capacity. To your question, the "3" in L<3 will be calculated by Darknodes strictly by revenues, not by a potentially manipulable oracle. Although this may be a soft cap in Zero and One with Greycore secondary sigs and continuous fees. Conversely, tBTC's bond is overcollateralized by ETH, which is uncorrelated to usage of tBTC. Because the price of ETH does not increase with usage of tBTC, increased usage of tBTC will require more and more ETH to stay overcollateralized. As the article says, just 1% ($1.34B) of BTC's market cap ($134B) in tBTC would require $2.01B in bonded ETH, which is 10% of all ETH. 5% of BTC in tBTC, 56% of ETH. A bond whose value is tied to usage of its own network allows capacity to scale linearly. Further: Collateral is not the problem. Any technique that anyone uses to reduce collateral should be usable by any system doing interop. The real difference is that RenVM using its own token, so it is able to adjust its own economic parameters, and it does not need liquidation which we have seen fail as recently as last month. -Use RenVM => REN worth more => higher cap => can use RenVM even more -Use tBTC => ETH fluctuates independently => liquidations can occur => node operators get liquidated => can use tBTC less RenVM is much more capital efficient in the long-term, regardless of the specific collateral ratios required. It also doesn’t expose Darknodes to ETH risk (and even renBTC holders, if renBTC could sometimes only be reclaimed for ETH not actual BTC, like it systems with liquidation). Lastly, it has a bunch of practical defenses, like constantly shuffling its Darknode shards (instead of them sticking around for up to 6 months). And we have some nice UX features, like being able to move any amount of BTC at any time, straight into a smart contract call. Q:https://preview.tbtc.network/cms/resource/tbtc-security-model/developers/tbtc-security-model/. At the end of the article Ren's security model is briefly discussed, is this correct? A: For the record, that is an incorrect summary (either through not being sure how things works, or in an attempt to discredit our security model). RenVM is not a federated peg. Our shards are designed to have up to ~200 nodes in them. tBTC has three (3). Seems the latter is a lot closer to a federation than the former. Q: So RenVM can run on Binance chain instead of Ethereum? Or what would be the advantage (or goal)? Pls eli5.A: RenVM doesn’t run on any chain; it is its own network. However, it has host chains which are chains to which it can send assets. For example, you can send BTC to Ethereum, and in this scenario Ethereum is the host chain (it is hosting a non-native asset). Supporting Binance Chain would imply that RenVM can use it as another host chain. Q: If another host chain is implemented, would cross-host chain transactions be possible without doing any transactions with the token. Like: Bitcoin -> renBTC_ETH -> renBTC_BNB Without an intermediate step, and without paying Bitcoin transactions on the Bitcoin network. Unlike: Bitcoin -> renBTC_ETH -> Bitcoin -> renBTC_BNB A: Yep. A burn event would be generated on one host chain, and RenVM would produce a minting signature for the other host chain. No BTC moves on the Bitcoin chain, so no Bitcoin fees would be required. RenVM would still take a fee though. Q: Reading about sharding in the docs: it mentions load balancing. Would that be done on a monthly basis as the changeover in keys is done? A: At minimum, once per epoch. Q: I'm sure there were discussions about this before but I can't find anything on it. Is there a possibility where assets in custody in REN network could be greater than 1/3 of value of REN tokens and have the network still be secure? Or is this a big no no that the network will have to do everything for the 1/3 threshold not be crossed ? A: It’s not a big no no, it is still well collateralized at that point. However, it is a no no. 1/3rd is the limit above which an attack becomes theoretically profitable. It is still not practically profitable at that stage, and is also very difficult to actually pull off such an attack. So RenVM must aim to keep under 1/3rd, but if that threshold is crossed nothing bad happens immediately (this gives some time for fee adjustments that should have already been put in place by this point to kick in). We’re also looking at some proposals internally around how to recover the peg even if an attack does succeed (because 1/3rd is crossed by enough, and for long enough, that a profitable attack succeeds, or because an irrational attacker has decided to attack without the want for profit). That’s correct. We class these actors as “irrational adversaries”. This is an attacker that doesn’t care about the profitability as modelled by the protocol. It’s important to be able to resist such adversaries because, as you point out, there are adversaries that can achieve be profit from RenVM in a way that cannot be feasibly modelled. Q: How many hours can my VPS be down before it's Deregistered (not shalshed)? A: 12 hours. We’ll use Mainnet Subzero to establish parameters and change the thresholds if needed. Q: Which VPS provider (for Darknodes) is next? A: Azure is the next one on our list of VPS’s to support.
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Which are your Top 5 favourite coins out of the Top 100? An analysis.
I am putting together my investment portfolio for 2018 and made a complete summary of the current Top 100. Interestingly, I noticed that all coins can be categorized into 12 markets. Which markets do you think will play the biggest role in the coming year? Here is a complete overview of all coins in an excel sheet including name, market, TPS, risk profile, time since launch (negative numbers mean that they are launching that many months in the future) and market cap. You can also sort by all of these fields of course. Coins written in bold are the strongest contenders within their market either due to having the best technology or having a small market cap and still excellent technology and potential. https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1s8PHcNvvjuy848q18py_CGcu8elRGQAUIf86EYh4QZo/edit#gid=0 The 12 markets are
Currency 13 coins
Platform 25 coins
Ecosystem 9 coins
Privacy 10 coins
Currency Exchange Tool 8 coins
Gaming & Gambling 5 coins
Misc 15 coins
Social Network 4 coins
Fee Token 3 coins
Decentralized Data Storage 4 coins
Cloud Computing 3 coins
Stable Coin 2 coins
Before we look at the individual markets, we need to take a look of the overall market and its biggest issue scalability first: Cryptocurrencies aim to be a decentralized currency that can be used worldwide. Its goal is to replace dollar, Euro, Yen, all FIAT currencies worldwide. The coin that will achieve that will be worth several trillion dollars. Bitcoin can only process 7 transactions per second (TPS). In order to replace all FIAT, it would need to perform at at least VISA levels, which usually processes around 3,000 TPS, up to 25,000 TPS during peak times and a maximum of 64,000 TPS. That means that this cryptocurrency would need to be able to perform at least several thousand TPS. However, a ground breaking technology should not look at current technology to set a goal for its use, i.e. estimating the number of emails sent in 1990 based on the number of faxes sent wasn’t a good estimate. For that reason, 10,000 TPS is the absolute baseline for a cryptocurrency that wants to replace FIAT. This brings me to IOTA, which wants to connect all 80 billion IoT devices that are expected to exist by 2025, which constantly communicate with each other, creating 80 billion or more transactions per second. This is the benchmark that cryptocurrencies should be aiming for. Currently, 8 billion devices are connected to the Internet. With its Lightning network recently launched, Bitcoin is realistically looking at 50,000 possible soon. Other notable cryptocurrencies besides IOTA and Bitcoin are Nano with 7,000 TPS already tested, Dash with several billion TPS possible with Masternodes, Neo, LISK and RHOC with 100,000 TPS by 2020, Ripple with 50,000 TPS, Ethereum with 10,000 with Sharding. However, it needs to be said that scalability usually goes at the cost of decentralization and security. So, it needs to be seen, which of these technologies can prove itself resilient and performant. Without further ado, here are the coins of the first market
Market 1 - Currency:
Bitcoin: 1st generation blockchain with currently bad scalability currently, though the implementation of the Lightning Network looks promising and could alleviate most scalability concerns, scalability and high energy use.
Ripple: Centralized currency that might become very successful due to tight involvement with banks and cross-border payments for financial institutions; banks and companies like Western Union and Moneygram (who they are currently working with) as customers customers. However, it seems they are aiming for more decentralization now.https://ripple.com/dev-blog/decentralization-strategy-update/. Has high TPS due to Proof of Correctness algorithm.
Bitcoin Cash: Bitcoin fork with the difference of having an 8 times bigger block size, making it 8 times more scalable than Bitcoin currently. Further block size increases are planned. Only significant difference is bigger block size while big blocks lead to further problems that don't seem to do well beyond a few thousand TPS. Opponents to a block size argue that increasing the block size limit is unimaginative, offers only temporary relief, and damages decentralization by increasing costs of participation. In order to preserve decentralization, system requirements to participate should be kept low. To understand this, consider an extreme example: very big blocks (1GB+) would require data center level resources to validate the blockchain. This would preclude all but the wealthiest individuals from participating.Community seems more open than Bitcoin's though.
Litecoin : Little brother of Bitcoin. Bitcoin fork with different mining algorithm but not much else.Copies everything that Bitcoin does pretty much. Lack of real innovation.
Dash: Dash (Digital Cash) is a fork of Bitcoin and focuses on user ease. It has very fast transactions within seconds, low fees and uses Proof of Service from Masternodes for consensus. They are currently building a system called Evolution which will allow users to send money using usernames and merchants will find it easy to integrate Dash using the API. You could say Dash is trying to be a PayPal of cryptocurrencies. Currently, cryptocurrencies must choose between decentralization, speed, scalability and can pick only 2. With Masternodes, Dash picked speed and scalability at some cost of decentralization, since with Masternodes the voting power is shifted towards Masternodes, which are run by Dash users who own the most Dash.
IOTA: 3rd generation blockchain called Tangle, which has a high scalability, no fees and instant transactions. IOTA aims to be the connective layer between all 80 billion IOT devices that are expected to be connected to the Internet in 2025, possibly creating 80 billion transactions per second or 800 billion TPS, who knows. However, it needs to be seen if the Tangle can keep up with this scalability and iron out its security issues that have not yet been completely resolved.
Nano: 3rd generation blockchain called Block Lattice with high scalability, no fees and instant transactions. Unlike IOTA, Nano only wants to be a payment processor and nothing else, for now at least. With Nano, every user has their own blockchain and has to perform a small amount of computing for each transaction, which makes Nano perform at 300 TPS with no problems and 7,000 TPS have also been tested successfully. Very promising 3rd gen technology and strong focus on only being the fastest currency without trying to be everything.
Decred: As mining operations have grown, Bitcoin’s decision-making process has become more centralized, with the largest mining companies holding large amounts of power over the Bitcoin improvement process. Decred focuses heavily on decentralization with their PoW Pos hybrid governance system to become what Bitcoin was set out to be. They will soon implement the Lightning Network to scale up. While there do not seem to be more differences to Bitcoin besides the novel hybrid consensus algorithm, which Ethereum, Aeternity and Bitcoin Atom are also implementing, the welcoming and positive Decred community and professoinal team add another level of potential to the coin.
Aeternity: We’ve seen recently, that it’s difficult to scale the execution of smart contracts on the blockchain. Crypto Kitties is a great example. Something as simple as creating and trading unique assets on Ethereum bogged the network down when transaction volume soared. Ethereum and Zilliqa address this problem with Sharding. Aeternity focuses on increasing the scalability of smart contracts and dapps by moving smart contracts off-chain. Instead of running on the blockchain, smart contracts on Aeternity run in private state channels between the parties involved in the contracts. State channels are lines of communication between parties in a smart contract. They don’t touch the blockchain unless they need to for adjudication or transfer of value. Because they’re off-chain, state channel contracts can operate much more efficiently. They don’t need to pay the network for every time they compute and can also operate with greater privacy. An important aspect of smart contract and dapp development is access to outside data sources. This could mean checking the weather in London, score of a football game, or price of gold. Oracles provide access to data hosted outside the blockchain. In many blockchain projects, oracles represent a security risk and potential point of failure, since they tend to be singular, centralized data streams. Aeternity proposes decentralizing oracles with their oracle machine. Doing so would make outside data immutable and unchangeable once it reaches Aeternity’s blockchain. Of course, the data source could still be hacked, so Aeternity implements a prediction market where users can bet on the accuracy and honesty of incoming data from various oracles.It also uses prediction markets for various voting and verification purposes within the platform. Aeternity’s network runs on on a hybrid of proof of work and proof of stake. Founded by a long-time crypto-enthusiast and early colleague of Vitalik Buterin, Yanislav Malahov. Promising concept though not product yet
Bitcoin Atom: Atomic Swaps and hybrid consenus. This looks like the only Bitcoin clone that actually is looking to innovate next to Bitcoin Cash.
Dogecoin: Litecoin fork, fantastic community, though lagging behind a bit in technology.
Bitcoin Gold: A bit better security than bitcoin through ASIC resistant algorithm, but that's it. Not that interesting.
Digibyte: Digibyte's PoS blockchain is spread over a 100,000+ servers, phones, computers, and nodes across the globe, aiming for the ultimate level of decentralization. DigiByte rebalances the load between the five mining algorithms by adjusting the difficulty of each so one algorithm doesn’t become dominant. The algorithm's asymmetric difficulty has gained notoriety and been deployed in many other blockchains.DigiByte’s adoption over the past four years has been slow. It’s still a relatively obscure currency compared its competitors. The DigiByte website offers a lot of great marketing copy and buzzwords. However, there’s not much technical information about what they have planned for the future. You could say Digibyte is like Bitcoin, but with shorter blocktimes and a multi-algorithm. However, that's not really a difference big enough to truly set themselves apart from Bitcoin, since these technologies could be implemented by any blockchain without much difficulty. Their decentralization is probably their strongest asset, however, this also change quickly if the currency takes off and big miners decide to go into Digibyte.
Bitcoin Diamond Asic resistant Bitcoin and Copycat
Market 2 - Platform
Most of the cryptos here have smart contracts and allow dapps (Decentralized apps) to be build on their platform and to use their token as an exchange of value between dapp services.
Ethereum: 2nd generation blockchain that allows the use of smart contracts. Bad scalability currently, though this concern could be alleviated by the soon to be implemented Lightning Network aka Plasma and its Sharding concept.
EOS: Promising technology that wants to be able do everything, from smart contracts like Ethereum, scalability similar to Nano with 1000 tx/second + near instant transactions and zero fees, to also wanting to be a platform for dapps. However, EOS doesn't have a product yet and everything is just promises still. Highly overvalued right now. However, there are lots of red flags, have dumped $500 million Ether over the last 2 months and possibly bought back EOS to increase the size of their ICO, which has been going on for over a year and has raised several billion dollars. All in all, their market cap is way too high for that and not even having a product.
Cardano: Similar to Ethereum/EOS, however, only promises made with no delivery yet, highly overrated right now. Interesting concept though. Market cap way too high for not even having a product. Somewhat promising technology.
VeChain: Singapore-based project that’s building a business enterprise platform and inventory tracking system. Examples are verifying genuine luxury goods and food supply chains. Has one of the strongest communities in the crypto world. Most hyped token of all, with merit though.
Neo: Neo is a platform, similar to Eth, but more extensive, allowing dapps and smart contracts, but with a different smart contract gas system, consensus mechanism (PoS vs. dBfT), governance model, fixed vs unfixed supply, expensive contracts vs nearly free contracts, different ideologies for real world adoption. There are currently only 9 nodes, each of which are being run by a company/entity hand selected by the NEO council (most of which are located in china) and are under contract. This means that although the locations of the nodes may differ, ultimately the neo council can bring them down due to their legal contracts. In fact this has been done in the past when the neo council was moving 50 million neo that had been locked up. Also dbft (or neo's implmentation of it) has failed underload causing network outages during major icos. The first step in decentralization is that the NEO Counsel will select trusted nodes (Universities, business partners, etc.) and slowly become less centralized that way. The final step in decentralization will be allowing NEO holders to vote for new nodes, similar to a DPoS system (ARK/EOS/LISK). NEO has a regulation/government friendly ideology. Finally they are trying to work undewith the Chinese government in regards to regulations. If for some reason they wanted it shut down, they could just shut it down.
Stellar: PoS system, similar goals as Ripple, but more of a platform than only a currency. 80% of Stellar are owned by Stellar.org still, making the currency centralized.
Ethereum classic: Original Ethereum that decided not to fork after a hack. The Ethereum that we know is its fork. Uninteresing, because it has a lot of less resources than Ethereum now and a lot less community support.
Ziliqa: Zilliqa is building a new way of sharding. 2400 tpx already tested, 10,000 tps soon possible by being linearly scalable with the number of nodes. That means, the more nodes, the faster the network gets. They are looking at implementing privacy as well.
QTUM: Enables Smart contracts on the Bitcoin blockchain. Useful.
Icon: Korean ethereum. Decentralized application platform that's building communities in partnership with banks, insurance providers, hospitals, and universities. Focused on ID verification and payments. No big differentiators to the other 20 Ethereums, except that is has a product. That is a plus. Maybe cheap alternative to Ethereum.
LISK: Lisk's difference to other BaaS is that side chains are independent to the main chain and have to have their own nodes. Similar to neo whole allows dapps to deploy their blockchain to. However, Lisk is currently somewhat centralized with a small group of members owning more than 50% of the delegated positions. Lisk plans to change the consensus algorithm for that reason in the near future.
Rchain: Similar to Ethereum with smart contract, though much more scalable at an expected 40,000 TPS and possible 100,000 TPS. Not launched yet. No product launched yet, though promising technology. Not overvalued, probably at the right price right now.
ARDR: Similar to Lisk. Ardor is a public blockchain platform that will allow people to utilize the blockchain technology of Nxt through the use of child chains. A child chain, which is a ‘light’ blockchain that can be customized to a certain extent, is designed to allow easy self-deploy for your own blockchain. Nxt claims that users will "not need to worry" about security, as that part is now handled by the main chain (Ardor). This is the chief innovation of Ardor. Ardor was evolved from NXT by the same company. NEM started as a NXT clone.
Ontology: Similar to Neo. Interesting coin
Bytom: Bytom is an interactive protocol of multiple byte assets. Heterogeneous byte-assets (indigenous digital currency, digital assets) that operate in different forms on the Bytom Blockchain and atomic assets (warrants, securities, dividends, bonds, intelligence information, forecasting information and other information that exist in the physical world) can be registered, exchanged, gambled and engaged in other more complicated and contract-based interoperations via Bytom.
Nxt: Similar to Lisk
Stratis: Different to LISK, Stratis will allow businesses and organizations to create their own blockchain according to their own needs, but secured on the parent Stratis chain. Stratis’s simple interface will allow organizations to quickly and easily deploy and/or test blockchain functionality of the Ethereum, BitShares, BitCoin, Lisk and Stratis environements.
Status: Status provides access to all of Ethereum’s decentralized applications (dapps) through an app on your smartphone. It opens the door to mass adoption of Ethereum dapps by targeting the fastest growing computer segment in the world – smartphone users.16. Ark: Fork of Lisk that focuses on a smaller feature set. Ark wallets can only vote for one delegate at a time which forces delegates to compete against each other and makes cartel formations incredibly hard, if not impossible.
Neblio: Similar to Neo, but 30x smaller market cap.
NEM: Is similar to Neo No marketing team, very high market cap for little clarilty what they do.
Bancor: Bancor is a Decentralized Liquidity Network that allows you to hold any Ethereum token and convert it to any other token in the network, with no counter party, at an automatically calculated price, using a simple web wallet.
Dragonchain: The Purpose of DragonChain is to help companies quickly and easily incorporate blockchain into their business applications. Many companies might be interested in making this transition because of the benefits associated with serving clients over a blockchain – increased efficiency and security for transactions, a reduction of costs from eliminating potential fraud and scams, etc.
Skycoin: Transactions with zero fees that take apparently two seconds, unlimited transaction rate, no need for miners and block rewards, low power usage, all of the usual cryptocurrency technical vulnerabilities fixed, a consensus mechanism superior to anything that exists, resistant to all conceivable threats (government censorship, community infighting, cybenucleaconventional warfare, etc). Skycoin has their own consensus algorithm known as Obelisk written and published academically by an early developer of Ethereum. Obelisk is a non-energy intensive consensus algorithm based on a concept called ‘web of trust dynamics’ which is completely different to PoW, PoS, and their derivatives. Skywire, the flagship application of Skycoin, has the ambitious goal of decentralizing the internet at the hardware level and is about to begin the testnet in April. However, this is just one of the many facets of the Skycoin ecosystem. Skywire will not only provide decentralized bandwidth but also storage and computation, completing the holy trinity of commodities essential for the new internet. Skycion a smear campaign launched against it, though they seem legit and reliable. Thus, they are probably undervalued.
Market 3 - Ecosystem
The 3rd market with 11 coins is comprised of ecosystem coins, which aim to strengthen the ease of use within the crypto space through decentralized exchanges, open standards for apps and more
Nebulas: Similar to how Google indexes webpages Nebulas will index blockchain projects, smart contracts & data using the Nebulas rank algorithm that sifts & sorts the data. Developers rewarded NAS to develop & deploy on NAS chain. Nebulas calls this developer incentive protocol – basically rewards are issued based on how often dapp/contract etc. is used, the more the better the rewards and Proof of devotion. Works like DPoS except the best, most economically incentivised developers (Bookkeeppers) get the forging spots. Ensuring brains stay with the project (Cross between PoI & PoS). 2,400 TPS+, DAG used to solve the inter-transaction dependencies in the PEE (Parallel Execution Environment) feature, first crypto Wallet that supports the Lightening Network.
Waves: Decentralized exchange and crowdfunding platform. Let’s companies and projects to issue and manage their own digital coin tokens to raise money.
Salt: Leveraging blockchain assets to secure cash loands. Plans to offer cash loans in traditional currencies, backed by your cryptocurrency assets. Allows lenders worldwide to skip credit checks for easier access to affordable loans.
CHAINLINK: ChainLink is a decentralized oracle service, the first of its kind. Oracles are defined as an ‘agent’ that finds and verifies real-world occurrences and submits this information to a blockchain to be used in smart contracts.With ChainLink, smart contract users can use the network’s oracles to retrieve data from off-chain application program interfaces (APIs), data pools, and other resources and integrate them into the blockchain and smart contracts. Basically, ChainLink takes information that is external to blockchain applications and puts it on-chain. The difference to Aeternity is that Chainlink deploys the smart contracts on the Ethereum blockchain while Aeternity has its own chain.
WTC: Combines blockchain with IoT to create a management system for supply chains Interesting
Ethos unifyies all cryptos. Ethos is building a multi-cryptocurrency phone wallet. The team is also building an investment diversification tool and a social network
Aion: Aion is the token that pays for services on the Aeternity platform.
USDT: is no cryptocurrency really, but a replacement for dollar for trading After months of asking for proof of dollar backing, still no response from Tether.
Market 4 - Privacy
The 4th market are privacy coins. As you might know, Bitcoin is not anonymous. If the IRS or any other party asks an exchange who is the identity behind a specific Bitcoin address, they know who you are and can track back almost all of the Bitcoin transactions you have ever made and all your account balances. Privacy coins aim to prevent exactly that through address fungability, which changes addresses constantly, IP obfuscation and more. There are 2 types of privacy coins, one with completely privacy and one with optional privacy. Optional Privacy coins like Dash and Nav have the advantage of more user friendliness over completely privacy coins such as Monero and Enigma.
Monero: Currently most popular privacy coin, though with a very high market cap. Since their privacy is all on chain, all prior transactions would be deanonymized if their protocol is ever cracked. This requires a quantum computing attack though. PIVX is better in that regard.
Zcash: A decentralized and open-source cryptocurrency that hide the sender, recipient, and value of transactions. Offers users the option to make transactions public later for auditing. Decent privacy coin, though no default privacy
Verge: Calls itself privacy coin without providing private transactions, multiple problems over the last weeks has a toxic community, and way too much hype for what they have.
Bytecoin: First privacy-focused cryptocurrency with anonymous transactions. Bytecoin’s code was later adapted to create Monero, the more well-known anonymous cryptocurrency. Has several scam accusations, 80% pre-mine, bad devs, bad tech
Bitcoin Private: A merge fork of Bitcoin and Zclassic with Zclassic being a fork of Zcash with the difference of a lack of a founders fee required to mine a valid block. This promotes a fair distribution, preventing centralized coin ownership and control. Bitcoin private offers the optional ability to keep the sender, receiver, and amount private in a given transaction. However, this is already offered by several good privacy coins (Monero, PIVX) and Bitcoin private doesn't offer much more beyond this.
Komodo: The Komodo blockchain platform uses Komodo’s open-source cryptocurrency for doing transparent, anonymous, private, and fungible transactions. They are then made ultra-secure using Bitcoin’s blockchain via a Delayed Proof of Work (dPoW) protocol and decentralized crowdfunding (ICO) platform to remove middlemen from project funding. Offers services for startups to create and manage their own Blockchains.
PIVX: As a fork of Dash, PIVX uses an advanced implementation of the Zerocoin protocol to provide it’s privacy. This is a form of zeroknowledge proofs, which allow users to spend ‘Zerocoins’ that have no link back to them. Unlike Zcash u have denominations in PIVX, so they can’t track users by their payment amount being equal to the amount of ‘minted’ coins, because everyone uses the same denominations. PIVX is also implementing Bulletproofs, just like Monero, and this will take care of arguably the biggest weakness of zeroknowledge protocols: the trusted setup.
Zcoin: PoW cryptocurrency. Private financial transactions, enabled by the Zerocoin Protocol. Zcoin is the first full implementation of the Zerocoin Protocol, which allows users to have complete privacy via Zero-Knowledge cryptographic proofs.
Enigma: Monero is to Bitcoin what enigma is to Ethereum. Enigma is for making the data used in smart contracts private. More of a platform for dapps than a currency like Monero. Very promising.
Navcoin: Like bitcoin but with added privacy and pos and 1,170 tps, but only because of very short 30 second block times. Though, privacy is optional, but aims to be more user friendly than Monero. However, doesn't really decide if it wants to be a privacy coin or not. Same as Zcash.Strong technology, non-shady team.
Tenx: Raised 80 million, offers cryptocurrency-linked credit cards that let you spend virtual money in real life. Developing a series of payment platforms to make spending cryptocurrency easier. However, the question is if full privacy coins will be hindered in growth through government regulations and optional privacy coins will become more successful through ease of use and no regulatory hindrance.
Market 5 - Currency Exchange Tool
Due to the sheer number of different cryptocurrencies, exchanging one currency for the other it still cumbersome. Further, merchants don’t want to deal with overcluttered options of accepting cryptocurrencies. This is where exchange tool like Req come in, which allow easy and simple exchange of currencies.
Cryptonex: Fiat and currency exchange between various blockchain services, similar to REQ.
QASH: Qash is used to fuel its liquid platform which will be an exchange that will distribute their liquidity pool. Its product, the Worldbook is a multi-exchange order book that matches crypto to crypto, and crypto to fiat and the reverse across all currencies. E.g., someone is selling Bitcoin is USD on exchange1 not owned by Quoine and someone is buying Bitcoin in EURO on exchange 2 not owned by Quoine. If the forex conversions and crypto conversions match then the trade will go through and the Worldbook will match it, it'll make the sale and the purchase on either exchange and each user will get what they wanted, which means exchanges with lower liquidity if they join the Worldbook will be able to fill orders and take trade fees they otherwise would miss out on.They turned it on to test it a few months ago for an hour or so and their exchange was the top exchange in the world by 4x volume for the day because all Worldbook trades ran through it. Binance wants BNB to be used on their one exchange. Qash wants their QASH token embedded in all of their partners. More info here https://www.reddit.com/CryptoCurrency/comments/8a8lnwhich_are_your_top_5_favourite_coins_out_of_the/dwyjcbb/?context=3
Kyber: network Exchange between cryptocurrencies, similar to REQ. Features automatic coin conversions for payments. Also offers payment tools for developers and a cryptocurrency wallet.
Achain: Building a boundless blockchain world like Req .
Req: Exchange between cryptocurrencies.
Bitshares: Exchange between cryptocurrencies. Noteworthy are the 1.5 second average block times and throughput potential of 100,000 transactions per second with currently 2,400 TPS having been proven. However, bitshares had several Scam accusations in the past.
Loopring: A protocol that will enable higher liquidity between exchanges and personal wallets.
ZRX: Open standard for dapps. Open, permissionless protocol allowing for ERC20 tokens to be traded on the Ethereum blockchain. In 0x protocol, orders are transported off-chain, massively reducing gas costs and eliminating blockchain bloat. Relayers help broadcast orders and collect a fee each time they facilitate a trade. Anyone can build a relayer.
Market 6 - Gaming
With an industry size of $108B worldwide, Gaming is one of the largest markets in the world. For sure, cryptocurrencies will want to have a share of that pie.
Storm: Mobile game currency on a platform with 9 million players.
Fun: A platform for casino operators to host trustless, provably-fair gambling through the use of smart contracts, as well as creating their own implementation of state channels for scalability.
Electroneum: Mobile game currency They have lots of technical problems, such as several 51% attacks
Wax: Marketplace to trade in-game items
Market 7 - Misc
There are various markets being tapped right now. They are all summed up under misc.
OMG: Omise is designed to enable financial services for people without bank accounts. It works worldwide and with both traditional money and cryptocurrencies.
Power ledger: Australian blockchain-based cryptocurrency and energy trading platform that allows for decentralized selling and buying of renewable energy. Unique market and rather untapped market in the crypto space.
Populous: A platform that connects business owners and invoice buyers without middlemen. Invoice sellers get cash flow to fund their business and invoice buyers earn interest. Similar to OMG, small market.
Monacoin: The first Japanese cryptocurrency. Focused on micro-transactions and based on a popular internet meme of a type-written cat. This makes it similar to Dogecoin. Very niche, tiny market.
Revain: Legitimizing reviews via the blockchain. Interesting concept, though market not as big.
Augur: Platform to forecast and make wagers on the outcome of real-world events (AKA decentralized predictions). Uses predictions for a “wisdom of the crowd” search engine. Not launched yet.
Substratum: Revolutionzing hosting industry via per request billing as a decentralized internet hosting system. Uses a global network of private computers to create the free and open internet of the future. Participants earn cryptocurrency. Interesting concept.
Veritaseum: Is supposed to be a peer to peer gateway, though it looks like very much like a scam.
TRON: Tronix is looking to capitalize on ownership of internet data to content creators. However, they plagiarized their white paper, which is a no go. They apologized, so it needs to be seen how they will conduct themselves in the future. Extremely high market cap for not having a product, nor proof of concept.
Syscoin: A cryptocurrency with a decentralized marketplace that lets people buy and sell products directly without third parties. Trying to remove middlemen like eBay and Amazon.
Hshare: Most likely scam because of no code changes, most likely pump and dump scheme, dead community.
BAT: An Ethereum-based token that can be exchanged between content creators, users, and advertisers. Decentralized ad-network that pays based on engagement and attention.
Dent: Decentralizeed exchange of mobile data, enabling mobile data to be marketed, purchased or distributed, so that users can quickly buy or sell data from any user to another one.
Ncash: End to end encrypted Identification system for retailers to better serve their customers .
Factom Secure record-keeping system that allows companies to store their data directly on the Blockchain. The goal is to make records more transparent and trustworthy .
Market 8 - Social network
Web 2.0 is still going strong and Web 3.0 is not going to ignore it. There are several gaming tokens already out there and a few with decent traction already, such as Steem, which is Reddit with voting through money is a very interesting one.
Mithril: As users create content via social media, they will be rewarded for their contribution, the better the contribution, the more they will earn
Steem: Like Reddit, but voting with money. Already launched product and Alexa rank 1,000 Thumbs up.
Rdd: Reddcoin makes the process of sending and receiving money fun and rewarding for everyone. Reddcoin is dedicated to one thing – tipping on social networks as a way to bring cryptocurrency awareness and experience to the general public.
Kin: Token for the platform Kik. Kik has a massive user base of 400 million people. Replacing paying with FIAT with paying with KIN might get this token to mass adoption very quickly.
Market 9 - Fee token
Popular exchanges realized that they can make a few billion dollars more by launching their own token. Owning these tokens gives you a reduction of trading fees. Very handy and BNB (Binance Coin) has been one of the most resilient tokens, which have withstood most market drops over the last weeks and was among the very few coins that could show growth.
BNB: Fee token for Binance
Gas: Not a Fee token for an exchange, but it is a dividend paid out on Neo and a currency that can be used to purchase services for dapps.
Kucoin: Fee token for Kucoin
Market 10 - Decentralized Data Storage
Currently, data storage happens with large companies or data centers that are prone to failure or losing data. Decentralized data storage makes loss of data almost impossible by distributing your files to numerous clients that hold tiny pieces of your data. Remember Torrents? Torrents use a peer-to-peer network. It is similar to that. Many users maintain copies of the same file, when someone wants a copy of that file, they send a request to the peer-to-peer network., users who have the file, known as seeds, send fragments of the file to the requester., he requester receives many fragments from many different seeds, and the torrent software recompiles these fragments to form the original file.
Gbyte: Byteball data is stored and ordered using directed acyclic graph (DAG) rather than blockchain. This allows all users to secure each other's data by referencing earlier data units created by other users, and also removes scalability limits common for blockchains, such as blocksize issue.
Siacoin: Siacoin is decentralized storage platform. Distributes encrypted files to thousands of private users who get paid for renting out their disk space. Anybody with siacoins can rent storage from hosts on Sia. This is accomplish via "smart" storage contracts stored on the Sia blockchain. The smart contract provides a payment to the host only after the host has kept the file for a given amount of time. If the host loses the file, the host does not get paid.
Maidsafecoin: MaidSafe stands for Massive Array of Internet Disks, Secure Access for Everyone.Instead of working with data centers and servers that are common today and are vulnerable to data theft and monitoring, SAFE’s network uses advanced P2P technology to bring together the spare computing capacity of all SAFE users and create a global network. You can think of SAFE as a crowd-sourced internet. All data and applications reside in this network. It’s an autonomous network that automatically sets prices and distributes data and rents out hard drive disk space with a Blockchain-based storage solutions.When you upload a file to the network, such as a photo, it will be broken into pieces, hashed, and encrypted. The data is then randomly distributed across the network. Redundant copies of the data are created as well so that if someone storing your file turns off their computer, you will still have access to your data. And don’t worry, even with pieces of your data on other people’s computers, they won’t be able to read them. You can earn MadeSafeCoins by participating in storing data pieces from the network on your computer and thus earning a Proof of Resource.
Storj: Storj aims to become a cloud storage platform that can’t be censored or monitored, or have downtime. Your files are encrypted, shredded into little pieces called 'shards', and stored in a decentralized network of computers around the globe. No one but you has a complete copy of your file, not even in an encrypted form.
Market 11 - Cloud computing
Obviously, renting computing power, one of the biggest emerging markets as of recent years, e.g. AWS and Digital Ocean, is also a service, which can be bought and managed via the blockchain.
Golem: Allows easy use of Supercomputer in exchange for tokens. People worldwide can rent out their computers to the network and get paid for that service with Golem tokens.
Elf: Allows easy use of Cloud computing in exchange for tokens.
Market 12 - Stablecoin
Last but not least, there are 2 stablecoins that have established themselves within the market. A stable coin is a coin that wants to be independent of the volatility of the crypto markets. This has worked out pretty well for Maker and DGD, accomplished through a carefully diversified currency fund and backing each token by 1g or real gold respectively. DO NOT CONFUSE DGD AND MAKER with their STABLE COINS DGX and DAI. DGD and MAKER are volatile, because they are the companies of DGX and DAI. DGX and DAI are the stable coins.
DGD: Platform of the Stablecoin DGX. Every DGX coin is backed by 1g of gold and make use proof of asset consensus.
Maker: Platform of the Stablecoin DAI that doesn't vary much in price through widespread and smart diversification of assets.
EDIT: Added a risk factor from 0 to 10. The baseline is 2 for any crypto. Significant scandals, mishaps, shady practices, questionable technology, increase the risk factor. Not having a product yet automatically means a risk factor of 6. Strong adoption and thus strong scrutiny or positive community lower the risk factor. EDIT2: Added a subjective potential factor from 0 to 10, where its overall potential and a small or big market cap is factored in. Bitcoin with lots of potential only gets a 9, because of its massive market cap, because if Bitcoin goes 10x, smaller coins go 100x, PIVX gets a 10 for being as good as Monero while carrying a 10x smaller market cap, which would make PIVX go 100x if Monero goes 10x.
TRON new comer information. How to buy, exchange, and store TRON and other FAQ's.
Here are some FAQ's for anyone that is new to TRON and would like to learn more about the project. For some more information visit our wiki page or click here. What is TRON? From the white paper: TRON is a world-leading blockchain-based decentralized protocol that aims to construct a worldwide free content entertainment system with the blockchain and distributed storage technology. The protocol allows each user to freely publish, store and own data, and in the decentralized autonomous form, decides the distribution, subscription, and push of contents and enables content creators by releasing, circulating and dealing with digital assets, thus forming a decentralized content entertainment ecosystem. What does that mean? The root issue of the internet is that everything is hosted on central data centers of Facebook, Amazon, Netfilx, and Google plus some other "small" companies like drop box and such. This is a huge issue, because when you use these services that are "free" you are really paying by selling all the information you provide them in which tell sell to other people extending from anything you type to pictures and videos you upload. Additionally, especially with net neutrality being repealed, large companies will be able to prioritize themselves over competition, forcing you to pay a premium for your entertainment. TRON is a solution to that because it is aiming to be the foundation of a entirely new internet protocol. Data will be stored in fragments around the network that is provided by miners, truly decentralizing the internet. Its a self sustaining economy in which everyone provides a bit of storage to the network in reward for TRX and in turn that TRX is used by you consuming entertainment. In this way entertainment providers can realistically generate reliable income based off the popularity of their content. Why is development taking so long? The web right now is built with whats called HTTP protocol and pre-made commands and functions already exist for developers to use. Because TRON's goal is to completely revolutionize the outdated HTTP protocol, much of the coding has to be done from scratch. Where can I buy TRON? Currently there are very limited places to directly buy TRON directly with FIAT money (government issued money). It can however be exchanged in a number of websites for bitcoin. Here are the steps you need to take: 1) Create an account at an exchange where you can purchase bitcoin or ethereum using fiat currencies. Buy bitcoin or ethereum. Here is a website that can help you find such exchange: https://www.buybitcoinworldwide.com (a side note is that ethereum usually transfers faster and has cheaper fees. You will have to transfer your bitcoin or ethereum in step 4) 2) Create an account at an exchange that will exchange bitcoin/ethereum to TRX. Any of the exchanges listed in the right info bar or bottom of this post will work. The exchange with the highest volume of TRON is binance.com and will be used in this example. 3) In Binance, locate your online wallet by dropping down the funds tab in the top right and select deposit withdraw. If you bought bitcoin find the bitcoin section under coins and click deposit. Copy this address as it will give you the address you will send your bitcoin to. The process is the same for Ethereum. 4) Using the exchange you created in step 1 to originally buy your bitcoin/ethereum, locate your wallet there, and select the withdraw button to send your bitcoin or ethereum to binance using the address you copied. 5) After a while your bitcoin/ethereum will show up in binance in which you can exchange it for TRX. Where do I store my TRON? It is not recommended to store your funds long term on an exchange as exchanges can be hacked, be shut down, or do wallet maintenance. If you do, it is recommended you use 2 factor authentication. Currently there is not an official TRON wallet, save keeping it on their website, but hardware wallets are usually the best way to store your crypto long term. Our wiki page has a number of options you can use. (https://www.reddit.com/Tronix/wiki/wallets) Social Links: Telegram: https://t.me/joinchat/GW8P8EK7dhkzOwFmxnuwqA Discord: https://discord.gg/ur9nKTe Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/tronfoundation/ Twitter: https://twitter.com/Tronfoundation Exchanges: Coinnest, Binance, Liqui, Gatecoin, Coinegg, HitBTC, Mercatox, Gate.io, CoolCoin, EtherDelta, Bit-Z, Qryptos
What’s up everyone! (TL:DR at the end this time, I've learned from my past mistakes haha)
Yep, it’s me again! New case for a new coin that seems to have taken off lately (and for good reason!) I’ve been researching it deeply lately. For those of you wondering (and in a voluntary spirit of being transparent), I do hold nice bags of the coins I post about. However I do not dump them. I’m a HODLER at heart, and love to invest in and hold coins that have a purpose. You know, like, an actual purpose. I have a Phore masternode, which i intend to keep running indefinitely. I also have a decent chunk of COSS, which I also intend to keep for a very long time (3+ years, until they are a full crypto one-stop-solution).
If you’ve missed my previous post, you can find it here:
For those who do not know me, or haven’t read my previous post, here’s my intro: I come from a business & logistics management background. I started investing in cryptocurrencies and trading a little more than six months ago. I am very detail oriented and I’ve been researching all kinds of cryptos, for hours a day, for the past six months. Cryptocurrencies went from a simple hobby to a burning passion during that 6 month period.
I’ve spotted great coins at great prices, and it seems I keep doing so! Firstly, Ethereum at 150$. Then NEO when it was antshares (sub-3$), Gas when it was antcoin (sub-30c), OMG when it was sub-1$, ETP at 1$ (ended up selling at 5$, too many wallet issues and kind of lost faith in it), COSS at 6 cents, that ended up getting a lot of visibility due to my last post (23K+ views), and finally, Phore at 60cents.
It took me less than an hour of research to understand Phore’s potential. I immediately purchased and setup a Masternode after seeing how undervalued it is compared to coins like Dash, PivX, and other privacy/masternode coins. I must admit, i FOMO’ed in really fast, but then kept on researching after I had secured my cheap PHR, and the more I researched, the more I saw the vision.
For those of you that don’t know, Phore is a fork of PIVX. It is a Masternode/Proof of Stake hybrid (MN + PoS), meaning 60% of the block reward goes to Masternodes, 30% to stakers, and 10% is left for the “development fund”.
For the newbs reading this (welcome, by the way!), a masternode is basically a node that you deploy on a virtual server (or on your own computer) and it basically verifies the blockchain and maintains concensus alongside the other nodes. You need to “lock” 10000 phore to deploy a Masternode. Proof of Stake, on the other end, basically means you can purchase coins and “Stake them” (aka put them in your wallet) and they will also be used to validate the blockchain. Both masternodes and staking will give you rewards, in Phore coins. Masternodes more than staking, obviously, as you “lock” a rather high amount of coins to deploy one.
Allright, so, what’s so good about this Phore coin? Isn’t it just a PivX knock-off?
1) Well, first of all, The MN/PoS structure is simply genius IMO. Dash’s value has gone up a lot simply because there is so little in circulation and most of the coins are locked up in masternodes. But Dash is MN/PoW, basically Masternodes + Mining. Miners do not have as big an incentive to hold unlike MN’s, it’s their mining equipment that generates them Dash. In Phore’s Case, yes, we do have the Masternodes locking up most of the supply, but we also have the stakers that are incentivized to lock up their coins to stake, and generate some extra coins.
2) Which brings us to point 2. There is a BIG incentive to buy and hold this coin. Masternodes are being deployed at a rate of 5 to 10 per day. This means 50 to 100k phore are being purchased and locked up, every day. On top of that, people that cannot afford a costly masternode, can still buy a few thousand coins and earn “interests” as they help validating the blockchain too! This basically drains the order book, fast, and skyrockets the price.
3) What happens when the vast majority (65%+) of the coins are locked up in masternodes, and from the 35% remaining, most of it goes into “staking”? Here’s what happens: the supply becomes increasingly low, the demand increasingly high. People that own masternodes or own decent amounts of coins don’t wanna sell, as the “interests” they make double, triple, quadruple in value, incentivizing them even further to hold.
4) What I’ve described in points 1 to 3 is pretty basic stuff. Economics 101. It’s a positive feedback loop: More MN’s/stakers = less coins in circulation = higher price = higher “interests” earned = more people want in = even less coins in circulation = even higher price = even higher “interests”, and it repeats itself until an equilibrium is reached (judging from PivX, equilibrium is at or around 425M market cap). Everybody wants in early on PoS coins, even moreso with MN coins, because of that simple fact. Early dash masternode owners are pretty much laughing right now. Everyone FOMO’s a good masternode coin, and that’s a fact, pure and simple.
5) Alright, now let’s dive into the actual “technical” merits of Phore. Phore is developed by an anonymous team. The same team that created Kryptcoin a few years ago (a coin with a decentralized marketplace). The team performed in a stellar fashion with kryptcoin, as well as their marketplace. Unfortunately, they were way ahead of their time with the marketplace. Most people didn’t even know what a bitcoin was back then. Phore definitely has this “old school, underground project” feel to it, and you will notice a good chunk of its community on discord are crypto believers from well before crypto was even talked about. They are “remaking” Kryptcoin from scratch, with tons of added features, and an even better marketplace. The fact they pulled it off back then only further reassures me that they will pull it off even better this time. This team actually has something under its belt.
6) Phore will have SegWit, as well as Smart Contracts. Yep, you read that right, smart contracts and dApps will eventually be running on PHORE. Zerocoin protocol as well for completely anonymous transactions.
7) Phore is integrating a Decentralized marketplace based on OpenBazaar’s codebase. They aim to have it running smoother, with a better UI and make it very intuitive. If there’s one team you have to believe can pull it off, it’s definitely the Phore dev team (They already did it in the past!) And the best part is that it’s not for late 2018 unlike some other coins. Nope. We are already in the testing phase, and it should launch somewhere in Q1 2018.
8) Although it is obvious, I thought I’d mention it for the less familiar: 10% of each block reward goes to the development fund. This means the project has a constant flow of money to hire new devs, grow the marketing team, grow the project, pay for exchange listing fees, etc. (They’ve already added an extra dev & an extra marketing team member, just this week, and are already hiring right now for another dev position. So, if you are a talented dev, feel free to apply!)
9) They have applied for Binance today. Although this does NOT mean it is guaranteed, at all, it’s good to see them applying to a variety of exchanges. It is currently only available on cryptopia and is skyrocketing. Getting added to Binance, Bittrex and the likes would make it explode in a ridiculous way.
10) Point number 10 will be a little off topic, to put us in context for point #11. Personally, I like to contribute feedback to projects i truely believe in. One example I came up with was a cool idea for COSS and I let Rune (COSS founder) know about it. Basically, when COSS will get FIAT trading, it is impossible for people to get USD and EUR “fee split” from holding COSS, as USD and EUR are not compatible with the DAO, which is an Ethereum Smart Contract.
My way around this was to create a “COSSusd and a COSSeur”, basically an ERC20 token that’s automatically created/destroyed as FIAT is deposited/withdrawn from the exchange. People sending fiat over to COSS would basically be credited with the “COSSusd or COSSeur”, trade with it, and then when they want to withdraw they would exchange their ERC20 for FIAT and withdraw it via wire transfer. The whole thing would be smart-contract powered and transparent so there is always the same number of COSSusd and Real USD on COSS.
Basically, this would result in COSS holders receiving “fiat dividends” as well, and not only “crypto dividends”. Rune is currently in the process of getting legal opinion on this idea as he is an adamant believer in compliance and wants to do everything by the Book.
11) Well, for Phore, I’ve also contributed a few ideas to attempt to make the marketplace go viral. Viral as in mainstream viral, not only viral in the crypto-space. The devs, advisors, marketing team, advisors and even the community were all very impressed and took notes of everything. Now I cannot comment on what will and what won’t be implemented, but overall my feedback was received in an extremely positive manner. Here goes:
Basically an easy gateway that's only fiat > phore. Coded in a way that when you purchase with fiat it automatically sends it to your wallet (and obviously we'd need to have a phore mobile wallet app).
This is how Phore will go mainstream, no way around it, unless we wanna wait 10+ years for every crypto "newbies" coming in to actually go through the lengthy process of learning about crypto, how they work, familiarize themselves, etc. So many newbies flooding in, we definitely need easy one-click fiat > phore solution.
Plus it would be super easy for me or phore marketing team (or both, working together) to put up a small nice and concise "press release kit" and send it out to all the major media outlets (all the big blogs, bloomberg, yahoo finance, lifestyle blogs for the libertarian / marijuana users / all the people that are into the whole “freedom thing” as well as all media outlets targeted to the 18-30 crowd).
Facebook advertising campaigns (targeting 18-35 age range, people interested in crypto, people interested in "online commerce", etc etc.) as well as google advertising campaigns (people search amazon or ebay, and they find our sponsored paid ad on top saying "thinking of trying amazon? Check out the phore marketplace, it's cheaper, blockchain-powered and 100% decentralized".
*Instagram campaigns as well, lots of the 16-30 crowd there. Instagram, google, Facebook and Reddit campaigns and any other viable channels. We can do all these things AND succeed at them quite easily, all we need is 1) an intuitive marketplace, which the devs are busting their asses off to achieve and we KNOW it'll be phenomenal, and 2) a fiat > phore gateway integrated. That second point will make or break it in terms of mainstream adoption, hence why it's indispensable to have it before we tackle "mainstream marketing" via FB, IG, Google, Reddit, Twitter, Blogs & Other Media outlets.
Ideally the fiat > phore gateway would be on the website itself, so people get credited their phore directly on their marketplace account. With a mobile wallet being a nice add-on of course so they can keep the extra phore in there when not in use, and 1-click transfer from marketplace to mobile wallet and vice versa, "a la paypal/dash evolution.
TL;DR for the lazy: Masternodes + PoS // Self-sufficient project due to the “treasury fund” // Stellar team who has ALREADY DONE THIS before // Currently underserved (cryptopia only) // Team applied to exchanges including Binance// Segwit + Smart Contracts + Strong privacy features // Decentralized Marketplace being beta tested as we speak and launching Q1 2018 // Strong incentive to hold as both Masternodes AND stakers dry up the supply for staking purposes, which creates a positive feedback loop (coins get bought, price goes up making the “staking & MN rewards go up”, making more people want a MN or Stake, more people buy, price rises again, “interests” earned go up, rinse and repeat in an endless loop until equilibrium is reached).
Currently, a masternode generates roughly 120phweek. Calculate Phore’s current price multiplied by 120 and you’ll get a pretty solid estimate of the weekly revenue generated from a Masternode.
Slack log for Ark token's value proposition discussion 16-07-18
Please find below a log of the discussion we had in slack regarding the ark token's value proposition. Some of the community members who happen to be long term holders of ark feel that the ark token's value proposition isn't clearly communicated by the team so they asked about it. I'm posting the entire discussion it here to make a permanent record since slack wipes messages after a while. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- arigard [7:21 PM] Hey team, so I'm curious. Is there any update on a new white paper at all that was being mentioned? I've been holding Ark since it hit Bittrex and I personally don't really have a clear idea about how the token is going to work in the overall picture, or what really the direction is for the project once v2 is out. It feels like things have gone a bit flat recently, are there any updates on direction and what the plan is once V2 is live? Is there any idea about when it might go live? Or how the Ark token will fit into the economy (will it be a gas?). I see a lot of other projects i'm invested in coming up with very clear roadmaps/dates and direction about what they want to be and I still personally feel Ark's message is a little confused and hard to read especially for people who are not coders/developers. rob [ Ark Labs ] [7:22 PM] the roadmap is on the site, arkdirectory.com/kits has nice presentations and other goodies roks0n (deadlock) [7:23 PM] @Matthew_DC mentioned a couple of days ago that he’s preparing several blog posts which should explain most of these @arigard rob [ Ark Labs ] [7:23 PM] the Blog also goes into lots of v2 details Djenny Floro (Ark Tribe) [7:24 PM] Hi everyone. rob [ Ark Labs ] [7:24 PM] Ark is Ark, not like Eth with gas, hence no gas. Hey @Djenny Floro (Ark Tribe) welcome back Djenny Floro (Ark Tribe) [7:24 PM] Hey rob, hi Rok :slightly_smiling_face: roks0n (deadlock) [7:25 PM] Rob, I think he means how everything will be connected with ArkVM etc. similar conversation as the one few days ago (edited) Djenny Floro (Ark Tribe) [7:25 PM] It's been a while, but I was head on in the project, sorry for not showing more often. arigard [7:25 PM] Yeah my main question is really I still don't know what will give the actual Ark token value . goldenpepe [7:25 PM] we dont know how the arkvm will work All we can do is wait Doubled1c3 (ArkStickers.com) [7:26 PM] uploaded and commented on this image: bucket.jpg @Djenny Floro (Ark Tribe) goldenpepe [7:26 PM] We can make assumptions but that's all they'll be roks0n (deadlock) [7:26 PM] @arigard this was the discussion: https://arkecosystem.slack.com/archives/C2ABRLZB8/p1531422791000216 roks0n (deadlock) definitely, I’m not blaming anyone :slightly_smiling_face: Was just curious if there were any developments in terms of the updated whitepaper because I was reading one of the threads on reddit from 6 months ago where it was mentioned you’re looking to hire someone write it up. Posted in #generalJul 12th arigard [7:26 PM] And I kind of feel this is such a big elephant in the room for people in the long run. roks0n (deadlock) [7:26 PM] click on the link and read from that post on (edited) arigard [7:26 PM] ok Djenny Floro (Ark Tribe) [7:27 PM] I saw that there has been some drawbacks with the V2 ? (Not sure if it's exact, I only came a few times and seemed to understand it was so) goldenpepe [7:28 PM] There are just some incompatibilities between v1 and v2 in devnet which is why devnet is currently down rob [ Ark Labs ] [7:28 PM] ArkVM may be unnecessary as more modern approaches to handling contracts are available, one of the main issue is having them be distributed just like the tokens. goldenpepe [7:28 PM] There's a community run v2-only devnet though #devnet_unofficial rob [ Ark Labs ] [7:28 PM] it's more like drawback with v1 arigard [7:30 PM] I mean I've seen a lot of stuff in that discussion discussed over the past year and there still seems to be no concrete answers coming out and that is a bit of worry to me personally. It makes it look like the team doesn't even know. I think most that know of Ark understand it wants to create an easy way to deploy blockchains and work as a platform and have some inoperability options. But the fundamentals of how that work right now seems to be up in the air. In other projects I know what gives those tokens value, but in Ark I don't, so it's hard for me as an investor to really sell to someone else the benefits of the token when there is a big question mark still on it. rob [ Ark Labs ] [7:33 PM] do you know that Ark Deployer has been available for quite some time? arigard [7:34 PM] Yes, that doesn't really answer any questions though. mak [7:34 PM] Ark deployer helps the main chain's business case somehow? arigard [7:35 PM] What gives Ark token actual value? Like what is the reason people need to buy and hold the Ark token? That is my question. Djenny Floro (Ark Tribe) [7:36 PM] @mak what you're saying is kinda like answering you can use a hammer when asked what a nail do. arigard [7:36 PM] You don't need to buy the Ark token to deploy a chain. You can just do it. Djenny Floro (Ark Tribe) [7:36 PM] I mean, the Ark Deployer doesn't answer what's the Ark. mak [7:36 PM] @Djenny Floro (Ark Tribe) my point was directed towards rob's comment. I think you misunderstood it. Djenny Floro (Ark Tribe) [7:37 PM] @mak My bad then. I apologize. Blockhunter [7:38 PM] :boogieark9: rob [ Ark Labs ] [7:38 PM] " I think most that know of Ark understand it wants to create an easy way to deploy blockchains and work as a platform and have some inoperability options. But the fundamentals of how that work right now seems to be up in the air." This is why I wrote that.. there is no mystery of how that works. You are mistaken or uninformed. arkenstone [7:38 PM] That's the problem here because team is programming orientated but there hasn't been alot done on business aspect of the token and marketing investor point big view mak [7:38 PM] That only explains the value of the ark codebase not the blockchain though arigard [7:38 PM] I think you seem to be trying to turn the argument in a seperate direction. It's a simple question. What gives the Ark token value. rob [ Ark Labs ] [7:39 PM] The market does. It's on 19 different exchanges. arigard [7:39 PM] Seems like you are being unhelpfully obtuse. I'll rephrase. roks0n (deadlock) [7:39 PM] so one thing that is clear to me is interoperability using ACES, where ARK is used as a “middleman” between two different chains, so if there’s high volume between those chains, it means the volume of ark increases as well .. what I’d like to know is how things will work with arkvm and how it will all work with sidechains (on eth, all the side chains will basically link back to the main chain which will be the one responsible for security afaik?) arigard [7:39 PM] What gives the Ark token value in the Ark ecosystem. Blockhunter [7:40 PM] Vote for Pedro he will make all your dreams come true arigard [7:40 PM] Eth is a gas, Waves is a gas. Ark is... what? mak [7:40 PM] ACES can work with any chains though. Doesn't have to be ark main chain. So I guess tomorrow persona can become the settlement layer for the Ark ecosystem and there's no incentive to stop it from happening. arigard [7:40 PM] ^ roks0n (deadlock) [7:41 PM] Mak, correct but if there are already lots of chains connected between ARK, it will be more appealing to link it through ARK directly Djenny Floro (Ark Tribe) [7:41 PM] As I understand it, ACES could be using any given blockchain as the middle man... roks0n (deadlock) [7:41 PM] it doesn’t mean that it can’t be copied tho arigard [7:41 PM] But there are no chains connected through Ark atm That have any real value anyway roks0n (deadlock) [7:41 PM] eth and btc are arigard [7:41 PM] And they can be connected through any Ark clone. bangomatic [7:41 PM] I'd love to hear the Ark team chime in on this discussion arigard [7:42 PM] So anyone can come along and make another chain that can instantly overtake Ark at this present time if there isn't a failsafe reason for Ark to be the defacto currency. rob [ Ark Labs ] [7:42 PM] https://arkecosystem.slack.com/archives/C2ABRLZB8/p1531762883000422 you can't keep saying things like this as if they are true. arigard That have any real value anyway Posted in #generalToday at 7:41 PM Blockhunter [7:42 PM] Interoperability to the moon mak [7:42 PM] "it will be more appealing to link it through ARK directly" Currently Ark is the only mature chain because it's been around longer but the moment persona or some other bridge chain gets listed on an exchange that dynamic is no longer there. So why would you prefer Ark over persona when that happens. That's the question as far as I understand it. (edited) rob [ Ark Labs ] [7:43 PM] Persona has other goals, not duplicating Ark goals Djenny Floro (Ark Tribe) [7:43 PM] @bangomatic Hi! arigard [7:43 PM] What current sidechain of Ark has real value/position in the crypto market? Persona? bangomatic [7:43 PM] hey @Djenny Floro (Ark Tribe)! mak [7:43 PM] The blockchain as a transaction medium doesn't care about secondary goals. It still has all the capabilities that Ark has. Colby [7:43 PM] What has value right now? :thinking_face: rob [ Ark Labs ] https://arkecosystem.slack.com/archives/C2ABRLZB8/p1531762883000422 you can't keep saying things like this as if they are true. https://arkecosystem.slack.com/archives/C2ABRLZB8/p1531762883000422 Posted in #generalToday at 7:42 PM arigard [7:43 PM] Ark's ecosystem at present is not big enough to be a reason not to just take the tech and start your own. To think otherwise is ludicrous. rob [ Ark Labs ] [7:44 PM] that's a fine opinion Jarunik [7:44 PM] it is harder than you think :slightly_smiling_face: arigard [7:44 PM] We aren't Eth with multi $100mn + start ups and even if we were, what's currently to stop one of those just overtaking Ark and leaving it behind? Jarunik [7:45 PM] i hope some ark clones get really sucessful to be honest :slightly_smiling_face: Colby [7:45 PM] Same here! Jarunik i hope some ark clones get really sucessful to be honest :slightly_smiling_face: Posted in #generalToday at 7:45 PM Blockhunter [7:45 PM] HODL ROCKET TECHNOLOGY mak [7:45 PM] Same here but then there's no reason to hold Ark over something else arigard [7:45 PM] i hope so too if there is some reason for Ark to always be there at the top considering it's the Ark platform. Colby [7:45 PM] But the thing is that I am wondering, if ark clones get successful, what benefits does it give back to ark Djenny Floro (Ark Tribe) [7:45 PM] @Jarunik to create an ecosystem? mak [7:45 PM] Right now we have to consider Ark's value not the other bridge chains arigard [7:45 PM] But if there isn't a reason for Ark to exist at the top, why are we all holding it? Colby [7:45 PM] Haha I think we are all thinking the same :slightly_smiling_face: arigard [7:45 PM] It's a terrible business plan rob [ Ark Labs ] [7:46 PM] the point of BridgeChains is to allow new projects with no access the market a path to them through Ark, and hence gain value. Other blockchains connections are through ACES, such as BTC, LTC, ETH, and more coming.. Persona has a way to trade Ark <> Prs arigard [7:47 PM] What is to stop them from getting their own exchanges in the future and just using Ark as a stepping stone to becoming their own platform operator? mak [7:47 PM] Sure rob, but there's now 10 different projects doing the same and they are faster in development than the ark team is arigard [7:47 PM] ^ Blockhunter [7:47 PM] Ark is the Yoda of blockchain and they need a better catchphrase. Better than ark gives no dates or point click blockchain arigard [7:48 PM] This attitude seems horribly naive if this is the value proposition. mak [7:48 PM] All of us believe in the vision that Ark brought us but I personally am not sure if Ark is the best option to execute that vision in time arigard [7:48 PM] The issue is, we don't know what the value proposition is. mak [7:48 PM] Other projects seem much faster rob [ Ark Labs ] [7:48 PM] if you are into speculation, which it seems you are, then on paper all of your projects with no code are better and have more value than Ark arigard [7:48 PM] That's not true at all. lol. Matthew_DC [7:49 PM] At the most base level, ARK is a common currency token that is essentially automatically compatible with every bridge chain that is built based on ARK and is optimized for transaction volume and throughput to avoid bloat of other mechanisms introduced by the other chains. That is at the most basic level. By holding the ARK token itself, you will be able to enact the functions of multiple bridged chains both issued by our team and others. You will also be able to utilize the ARK chain as a pegged token to many bridged chains but that process will be transparent to users as it will be done behind the scenes without the user needing to do any functions. To think that someone will fork the code and generate a more effective ARK main chain means you have no confidence in the ARK team as the primary developer of the technology itself. In this case, if we are not and someone pushes a better version of the network, then I would argue maybe they SHOULD be chosen. That is the point of a free and open market. Not to mention the potential for registering and providing snapshot hashes to the main ARK blockchain to provide added security measures to a bridge chain with lower security due to lower market share etc, those are just baseline reasons. As I mentioned the other day, at face value, consider this. What brings value to Litecoin or Bitcoin or Doge? In essence, ARK is a more effective currency and base network than all of these aforementioned networks with all of the added benefits being added for additional use cases. roks0n (deadlock) [7:50 PM] will ark based chains be bridged via arkvm? goldenpepe [7:50 PM] They cant be You'd need the VM on both sides Matthew_DC [7:50 PM] I am currently on a conference call and have a lot going on so I can't respond too much. goldenpepe [7:50 PM] You can use AIP11's new tx types to do a sort of escrow between chains though i think mak [7:50 PM] @Matthew_DC Are you saying that the bridgechains deployed by ark-deployer don't have the same features? rob [ Ark Labs ] [7:50 PM] ArkVM is not for bridging chains goldenpepe [7:51 PM] It can be Coinme [7:51 PM] And ICO's that will join Ark in the future will use it for buying their token. goldenpepe [7:51 PM] But both chains will need to be running the VM Matthew_DC [7:51 PM] The ARK main chain will have specific methods of allowing token transfer and utilization between chains to include quasi-centralized methods through aces, decentralized aces based intermediary networks, Time locked transfers, among custom built smart contract like logic built into the core technology itself that doesn't make the network susceptible to the bloat and mis-utilization an vulnerabilities of full VM use. goldenpepe [7:51 PM] (which the main ark chain wont be) mak [7:51 PM] "ICO's that will join Ark in the future will use it for buying their token" Or any other bridgechain that's listed on exchanges @Matthew_DC So will all of the bridgechains, no? I could start an ACES node today for persona and it will have no difference from what you describe. Matthew_DC [7:52 PM] @mak no, we promised ARK would be open source and everything we build for the core ARK blockchain will be open source. arigard [7:53 PM] You can be open source and still protect your value.. Matthew_DC [7:54 PM] The point of ARK from day 1 has been to create a better base layer blockchain technology and protocol for everyone everywhere to be able to use to create anything they can dream up. The ARK token is a core payment layer for the ecosystem including any applications we build ourselves, sponsor, partner with, or support. mak [7:54 PM] It seems like the team's vision for Ark is as a software product only and there's no business plan for the main chain. Which is fine but it's not explained as such. (edited) Blockhunter [7:55 PM] Great to see such active discussions goldenpepe [7:55 PM] I think what Matt is trying to portray is this: A single universal Ark Ecosystem wallet holding ARK that has a nice UI with a list of dapps in the ecosystem You select a dapp You send a tx from the wallet using Ark ----------------Everything below this line is transparent to the user----------------- The Ark transaction has instructions in the smartbridge field The Ark gets converted to dappCoin via an intermediary like ACES (trustful) or a trustless escrow smart contract The intermediary received Ark and uses the dappCoin on the dapp chain to do whatever it is the user wanted to do using the instructions in the smartbridge field The dappchain responds to the request to the intermediary Intermediary sends an Ark tx with the results of the dapp computation/action in the smartbridge field ---------------Everything above this line is transparent to the user------------------- After 8+ seconds, user's wallet shows them the result of their interaction with the dapp bridgechain That's where the value of Ark will come from The Ark coin will be a universal "omni-coin" Matthew_DC [7:56 PM] :this: This goldenpepe [7:56 PM] That will instantly shapeshift into bridgechain coins to interact with the bridgechain dapp mak [7:58 PM] I understand what your point is and I agree it will work but only as long as none of the bridge chains are on an exchange when for example persona gets listed on binance the scenario changes and now either chain can become the backbone of the ark ecosystem arigard [7:58 PM] Yes. We see that. But hypothetically what is to stop a bridged Ark chain from becoming bigger than Ark and then going on to become that gateway? At this point it just seems to be hopium that the Ark network will always be the one people look to. But in one year, or two, or five, it might not be the case. What is to stop Ark being just sidelined if another team come along with develop on what Ark has built and propel it forward and take the mantle? goldenpepe [7:58 PM] What you say will be a problem only if the utility of the dapp coin is greater than the utility of the ark omnicoin Would you rather hold a coin that can do one thing and is forever tied to a single chain arigard [7:59 PM] But in other crypto's an app becoming sucessfull is a benefit. In Ark's network it could be a negative. goldenpepe [7:59 PM] Or would you rather hold a coin that can interact with that single chain and 3232523432 others arigard [7:59 PM] But why can't another coin become an omnicoin? If there are no limitations against it goldenpepe [7:59 PM] Why can't another coin become ethereum? mak [7:59 PM] "What you say will be a problem only if the utility of the dapp coin is greater than the utility of the ark omnicoin" Or if it gives out better staking returns etc like persona because of higher inflation rate goldenpepe [7:59 PM] if there are no limitations against it You can literally go on AWS right now and deploy an ethereum clone chain arigard [7:59 PM] It can, but an ETH token can't oust ETH That's the difference. We are giving people an easy route here. rob [ Ark Labs ] [7:59 PM] do you often think your children should not surpass you? Or is that the hope? Matthew_DC [8:00 PM] Well it's about security, trust, potential vulnerabilities due to added functionality, the ability of the bridgechain team to create interactions and focus on use cases for their token outside of their core use, etc. But that's the point of open and free markets goldenpepe [8:00 PM] There is a solution to your concern @arigard Matthew_DC [8:00 PM] What is to stop someone from being better than Bitcoin? arigard [8:01 PM] I think all these strawman arguments are fun, but they still aren't adressing the issuel goldenpepe [8:01 PM] Instead of having Ark Deployer literally cloning the ark codebase, have it be a turnkey solution to run a layer 2 chain Matthew_DC [8:01 PM] You could go fork Ethereum right now and have an exact copy of the capability of the main Eth chain. goldenpepe [8:01 PM] bridgechain dapps can be "colored coins" that are forever tied to the main chain arigard [8:01 PM] Yeah but you wouldn't have those businesses on the chain. goldenpepe [8:01 PM] but that would introduce bloat Matthew_DC [8:01 PM] So you are saying the utility of Ethereum is adoption. arigard [8:01 PM] And those businesses won't have the potential to become the main ETH. Matthew_DC [8:01 PM] Which is the case for the value of any token. goldenpepe [8:01 PM] @arigard It sounds like you want ark to become Ethereum Plasma arigard [8:02 PM] I just want an answer. Matthew_DC [8:02 PM] How many companies are pulling their ERC20 tokens off of Ethereum because of the issues? Colby [8:02 PM] Yeah but correct me if im wrong goldenpepe [8:02 PM] There is no answer that will satisfy what you are asking arigard [8:02 PM] And i keep getting strawmanned. Colby [8:02 PM] Ethereum projects NEED eth for gas Matthew_DC [8:02 PM] We talk to people almost every day that are looking to leave Ethereum. Colby [8:02 PM] Ark is needed for? arigard [8:02 PM] ^ Colby [8:02 PM] This is all I am wondering, where does the ark coin fit into it I love the idea goldenpepe [8:02 PM] @arigard You want ark-based coins to rely on Ark The team wants the Ark chain to not be bloated The solution to this is unironically ethereum plasma and sharding Colby [8:02 PM] but have been waiting for a while to know how the Ark coin will actually be used goldenpepe [8:03 PM] Shards in ethereum are basically "bridgechains" arigard [8:03 PM] Ok, and those teams might be big enough and clued up enough to eventually knock Ark from being the de facto omni coin. That's the worry. If this is in fact the possibility. Then it should be clear. mak [8:03 PM] "You could go fork Ethereum right now and have an exact copy of the capability of the main Eth chain." @Matthew_DC Ethereum has value because all the dapps live on it which is not true for ark arigard [8:03 PM] Because as an investor it worries me, a lot. I don't know where the value of Ark as an investment is 100% right now. Jarunik [8:03 PM] Ark is basically the inverse approach to Ethereum. Eth goes for big one-fits all first and tries to shard ... Ark is creating shards and then combines them goldenpepe [8:03 PM] There is no solution to what @arigard and @mak are saying right now Literally no existing solution Only proposals like sharding arigard [8:04 PM] And all this noise about defensiveness doesn't help. These are legit concerns. Matthew_DC [8:04 PM] When was it not clear that if a company comes along and builds a better more used product it could potentially take over market share? That's how all free markets work. You can't believe in open source and build and open source product without that risk. arigard [8:04 PM] But that isn't the same thing. Ark is literally building THE tools for people to then do that. mak [8:04 PM] @Matthew_DC Just to clarify I appreciate the work you guys are doing but I want to make an informed investment decision about holding the ark token arigard [8:04 PM] As a platform. Jarunik [8:04 PM] yes ... that is the idea how to grow arigard [8:04 PM] if you cloned Bitcoin back in the day you were a seperate currency. Jarunik [8:04 PM] provide good tools for others to create chains arigard [8:04 PM] This is a platform, its totally different. And what we are discuswsing here is who runs that platform. Matthew_DC [8:05 PM] If someone launched an Ethereum chain right now and gained adoption there is a huge potential that all tokens decide to move their ERC20 tokens to the new chain and it becomes the new Ethereum and you have in essence lost all value because Ethereum is not capable of being used on the bridge chain as a currency. ARK maintains it's value if for no other reason than the pegged value to any chain we personally create to include VM chain, token issuance chain, etc. arigard [8:05 PM] If it's built by Ark, does Ark always retain control? if not, why? What happens if Ark ends up building tools for a subsidary project that propels itself above them. Investors will just move to that coin. Matthew_DC [8:05 PM] Because it's an open decentralized system. The problem is people don't actually believe in decentralization if it possibly harms their potential for monetary gain. rob [ Ark Labs ] [8:06 PM] we hope bridgechains get popular because that also means more for Ark in many ways. arigard [8:06 PM] You can be decentralized without being 100% altruistic. It's not mutually exclusive. mak [8:06 PM] @goldenpepe Since you guys claim that there's no solution for this how about I present one which @Matthew_DC can decide if it's useful or not. Make delegate voting for the ArkVM happen on the main chain. So anyone who wants to become a delegate for the VM needs to hold money on the main chain. arigard [8:07 PM] It just seems people are being dogmatic about this. And if this isn't about investment. Why have an ICO? Matthew_DC [8:07 PM] Ethereum being the core chain for all ERC20 token based businesses centralizes the industry in a massive way. Not only is Ethereum itself centralized in the way it's mining structure was developed, but it also is centralized in that if the Ethereum network is compromised, thousands of companies assets and business are now compromised. We don't believe that is the future. mak [8:07 PM] I'm not saying that this should be done for all sidechains. Just for the VM and it will be a special case. Matthew_DC [8:07 PM] We believe in a different business model. That has been at the core of every description and explanation I have given from day 1. arigard [8:07 PM] Ok and that's fine, but my point is this should be made very clear if it's the case. From the team officially. goldenpepe [8:07 PM] @mak now you're strawmanning me Matthew_DC [8:07 PM] Where is it not clear? goldenpepe [8:08 PM] I was addressing the fact that the idea that bridgechains shouldnt be independent and should be tied to Ark being in conflict with the Ark team's idea that the main chain should not be bloated with dapps The only plausible solution to that right now is Ethereum Plasma Sharding yokoama (thefoundry Delegate) [8:09 PM] Sharting mak [8:09 PM] "We believe in a different business model." I respect that. But it changes the ark's value proposition to just being a source of funding to the ark team and a means of speculation. goldenpepe [8:09 PM] Shards in ethereum are like bridgechains but the coins are all erc20s that rely on ethereum Matthew_DC [8:09 PM] People said ARK's DPoS mechanism would be a failure when we changed the voting structure because they said it wouldn't be secure enough. It has turned out to be massively secure compared to the centralized cartel run solutions of other DPoS chains. This is another fundamental issue where we believe we have a model that will work and will create value and thousands of use cases for the ARK token in a seamless way for the average user. goldenpepe [8:09 PM] and the shard blocks dont interfere or bloat up the "main" eth chain mak [8:09 PM] @goldenpepe I'm not suggesting deploying dapps on main chain. Just that the voting should take place there so there is always incentive to keep money on the main chain. Matthew_DC [8:10 PM] At no point did we say ARK was gas and have constantly made sure to outline the differences between ARK and Ethereum. I believe the Eth model is flawed. goldenpepe [8:11 PM] The current ethereum model is flawed If sharding works then it's going to solve a lot of its issues (i dont hold any ethereum btw) arigard [8:12 PM] At no point have we actually had an updated white paper discussing this question in detail, clearly. It's not on the website and if it is it's buried somewhere in a blog post. The fact these discussions keep cropping up is proof of this. nukacolaplease [8:12 PM] I think we don't understand clearly what makes Ark important after the launch of the sidechains, Ark will be only an "exchange token"? The sidechain doesn't need Ark for operating goldenpepe [8:12 PM] +1 on needing a new whitepaper Matthew_DC [8:12 PM] replied to a thread: This is a means of centralization of the network. Instead, by utilizing a form of pegged bridge chains, we can maintain a similar effect without creating centralization and reliance on 1 chain for others to properly function. arkenstone [8:12 PM] I think these things should be clearly written in a new WB and officially made public and promoted goldenpepe [8:12 PM] A new whitepaper would clear up so much FUD pieface [8:13 PM] Yeah I think a new WP is needed for sure arigard [8:13 PM] So don't start going "Oh everybody knows this, it's clear" Show me where on the front page of the website it tells you how the token mechanics will work in the ecosystem? It's not good it being on some powerpoint on a google drive, or hidden in comments in the slack. mak [8:13 PM] I though there wasn't going to be a new whitepaper. arigard [8:13 PM] It needs to be clear to investors how it works, exactly. goldenpepe [8:13 PM] I agree with arigard here I only know what I know because I live on slack Matthew_DC [8:13 PM] The solutions are still in development and there are always opportunities to continue to adapt the model, that's why I have these conversations and ask for feedback regularly, but the core fundamental belief of how open and free decentralized markets should work most likely won't change. arkenstone [8:13 PM] Same here goldenpepe [8:14 PM] The vast majority of ark holders have no idea they just bought bc of the cool red triangle arigard [8:14 PM] Stop playing cute, this is people's money you are asking for. So at least give them the benefit of being honest that there is no inherent business model reason why Ark will be necessary in the future. And let them make their decisions. roks0n (deadlock) [8:14 PM] I agree, it took me months of following discussion on slack and digging around reddit to get information arigard [8:14 PM] With proper information. mak [8:14 PM] replied to a thread: It's centralizing value onto one chain but doesn't bottleneck the ecosystem so I don't see anything being wrong with that. Matthew_DC [8:15 PM] replied to a thread: I'm not arguing with you and I made a clear post here within the last 2 days that our website messaging is shit and needs completely redone. If the ARK network is compromised or the consensus mechanism of the ARK main net is compromised then all subsequent networks reliant on that consensus would be compromised as well. mad4thrash [8:15 PM] In my opinion Ark's value come from (in the future) the fact that by holding one coin I can interact with every bridgechain plus any ACES services Matthew_DC [8:16 PM] So what I am saying is that we have to be cautious of these kinds of decisions and ensure that we aren't inadvertently creating attack vectors to take down partners, businesses, and other industries using the technology. I'm sorry guys, I have to go, but I would love to continue this conversation on Reddit or here at a later time. mak [8:16 PM] "all subsequent networks reliant on that consensus would be compromised as well" ^ Correction: only the VM chain will be compromised since I'm not advocating that all bridgechains should vote on the main chain. Matthew_DC [8:19 PM] In an isolated case, if we can map it out and vet the concept, I'm more than happy to hear it out and have the conversation. Solowatch [8:19 PM] So I think we can all agree an updated Whitepaper is due Matthew_DC [8:20 PM] This is a community project and we are shaping pieces of it together as we continue to build. We have already made changes based on community feedback on many occasions. So I would love to see someone post a proposal to reddit or even as an AIP at some point that we could discuss. Jarunik [8:20 PM] If you write a white paper it will be outdated soon :smile: Solowatch [8:21 PM] Well a V2 whitepaper shouldn’t be outdated soon I don’t care about a V1 or V1.5 whitepaper lol I want a whitepaper for V2 that’s clearly explaining all these concerns that the community has arkenstone [8:22 PM] :this: Solowatch [8:23 PM] I wrote a few questions down that I’ll post in here later today that @rob [ Ark Labs ] asked for. Please add to it if I missed anything once I do. arkenstone [8:23 PM] And I think now it's the time do it. Present it with full package on mainet launch.. (edited) Solowatch [8:23 PM] Or PM and I’ll add them before posting mak [8:25 PM] Anyways thanks for listening and responding @Matthew_DC. Some of us have been trying to discuss this with the ark team but didn't get much feedback until today. arigard [8:25 PM] Yeah +1 arkenstone [8:28 PM] Alot of early investors are getting worried
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